Where are YOU going when you die?

[optimuz-prym]

I've battled with a 'belief' system (sometimes a lack thereof) for quite some time. I was basically forced to grow up Catholic being put through Catholic school for 11 years, but it wasn't until around 6th grade that I really started questioning everything. The whole multiple-religion thing threw me off. As sad as this is to say, I was basically brought up in a bubble. I didn't know what seminary was until my SENIOR year in high school! Talk about sheltered. Anyhow, I used to believe in heaven and hell and everything in between. I went to church, prayed, and hell, I even sung in the church choir. After my religious beliefs ceased, I questioned my own death quite a bit, and even still do from time to time. My basic assumption now is that I'll be become nothing...I wont go anywhere...I wont meet up with lost relatives. My feelings now are almost 100% metaphysical. I think my body will decompose and my consciousness will become part of the collective conscousness and continue to exist separate from any 'self' that I have while here. I'm curious to know what other people's thoughts on this are. Do you think you'll 'go' anywhere? Do you believe you'll come back as something or someone else? Any insight would be much appreciated.

.moses.

[Miss Mustang]

I know there is something out there other then just us little beings on earth...... There is a higher power..... I believe in re-incarnation..... I dont believe in organized religion.... I lean more towards buddast (Sp?)

I think if you follow what you feel is right then you are good to go.....

Obviously Bundy and Dhamer and the like are fucked up and wrong for what they did but they were not right in the head.....

[ambeestar]

When I was younger, I wasn't raised in anything. Matter of fact, my parents were the best that the could be in NOT being role models in anyway. To save you all the sob story, I learned about drinking before I even learned about religion. When I got older, my brother started going to church, and I was jelous because he got to get out of the house instead of staying and doing nothing on a sunday. So I started going to church. Just to get out of the house. I sang in the choir, started playing my violin with them, and start co-teaching a class for younger kids. But I never believed a word of it. Not one fucking word. After that, my parents stopped letting me go, and they became Jehovah's Witnesses. That was a huge change for me, and extremely eye opening to the whole organized religion problem. My parents believed anything they were told to, and everything became convenient for them. They could celebrate their anniversary, but no other holidays where they had to spend money on us kids... They could drink still, and they now had all the reasons in the world to keep us from doing what we wanted. The world was bad, and so we were kept inside.
My ancestry is completely different from that too.. My mother, being Cherokee Indian, should really not fall into this Jehovah's Witness stuff. and my real dad, catholic pure and true. So eh... my whole belief has been pretty much fucked. I believe different things each day honestly. Sometimes, I believe in evolution, and that there's nothing. Sometimes the lonely side of me comes out and I think that maybe... there is a heaven, or... something.

[Miss Mustang]

*hugs* Ambree that sucks honey......

JW are as bad as the cult my cousins, and uncle joined down in Manti......

HOLY SHIT did they all go WWWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYY off the deep end.


They tried to recruit us at my dad's funeral.... Talk about bad taste.....

[Bhairava]

I know there is something out there other then just us little beings on earth...... There is a higher power..... I believe in re-incarnation..... I dont believe in organized religion.... I lean more towards buddast (Sp?)


I must say I totally agree! accept with the budhist part they lost me when they said life is about suffering. life is meant to be enjoyed and experianced to the fullest. without experiance how can you learn and grow and transform into a higher state of conciousness. and if you practice acts of good karma you will have less bad karma which brings about less suffering and more enjoyment! as for what happens to you when you die depends on what you did and what you learned in this life. thats what determines where and to what life you will be reincarnated into. and by adhering to the law of karma each life gets better and better and better. as far as meeting up with lost friends and reletives I believe souls travel together and most if not all of who you know in this life you will know in the next. anway thats my :2cents: death only leads to rebirth and should not be feared!

[kaelorama]

I dont belive in organized religion. But i do belive in a higher power, I do belive that when i die i will go to another relm. Wheather it be heaven or another stage in eternity.

[Akc814ilv]

I dont belive in organized religion. But i do belive in a higher power, I do belive that when i die i will go to another relm. Wheather it be heaven or another stage in eternity.


Thats pretty much exactly what I believe in as well.

And if there is a God, then hey great. I try and treat people the way I would like to be treated.

So I think anyone who approaches life with that sort of mindset will be ok one way or the other.

If God is so vain that he/she/it requires you to accept a certain religion or else you are going to hell.....well then FUCK IT, ill go chill with the devil, because if thats the case then Satan HAS to have the better sense of humor, and would probably be more fun to chill with out of the two. LOL.

[optimuz-prym]

Plus he probably has really good acid.

[Walka]

reincarnation

[adrena_line]

All I know is that energy cannot be created or destroyed...simply transferred :cool:

so who cares what happens really. The Bible is bullshit, the Koran is a lie...

;)
I wouldn't say I believed in 'reincarnation' though...........

just energy :)

[optimuz-prym]

All I know is that energy cannot be created or destroyed...simply transferred :cool:

so who cares what happens really. The Bible is bullshit, the Koran is a lie...

;)
I wouldn't say I believed in 'reincarnation' though...........

just energy :)

Where do you see your energy going?

[adrena_line]

I honestly don't know. Nobody does, if you think about it..I just choose not to care as much as some, who freak the fuck out about the idea of death and try to convince others that their delusions are 'true'.

I consider myself somewhat of a 'militant agnostic': I don't know and you don't either!!!

hehe

[Walka]

I honestly don't know. Nobody does, if you think about it..I just choose not to care as much as some, who freak the fuck out about the idea of death and try to convince others that their delusions are 'true'.

I consider myself somewhat of a 'militant agnostic': I don't know and you don't either!!!

hehe

oh I know the truth

think you can handle it?:D:p

[optimuz-prym]

enlighten us.

[Blacksunshine]

I dont try to figure out where I'm going in the afterlife...I just know I'm going to die. Ultamately I really dont care. But I THINK it would be fun to just become an energy...yes have the ability to "live" only not as a noun. (I really dont know how else to put that)


I do belive I have been here before...I've met a few people I've known, and I go with it. BUT I really dont think I'm comming back to earth...cept maybe as energy in order to have some good ol play time...It's fun here.


I dont belive in Christianity, not one bit. i dont like the idea of supressive religion. Those that push should go to heaven, and continue their little life of no free will...if that is what makes them happy.

As the first post stated....I was raised catholic...but with so many religions out there...how can any of them be true? it's all lifestyle, none of them are wrong I know that...faith is faith, have it and hold it close if it's what moves you, right on dont let anyone stand in the way of that.

I just walk around my little world spreading PLUR, giving the knowlege, experience and advise I have. I play hard, laugh lots, and truly live. I'm so content with that that I have sence decided I really dont care where I go when I die...If I turn in to energy as I hope I know it will be good and fun. If I go no where and become nothing, then it dosn't even matter anyway, and if there is a heaven where all those christian people go...then I will be going to mine....yes, you call it hell, I just dont follow that whole firey pit idea...that's just evil.


Where do I think people that aren't right in the head go? they go to their place, weather that be energy...perhaps they could be "bad" energy, if they go to a darker realm I dont know...I dont worry about them either. For people that conciously do fucked up shit...nope I dont judge them either, again, I just dont care.

*patiently awaits the prophecy*

[KC Meat]

I do belive that when i die i will go to another relm.Perhaps the realm of....MORTAL KOMBAT!!...lame game reference, I know...sue me..


Where do you see your energy going?I wanna be a lightning bolt!

[Drew]

I must say I totally agree! accept with the budhist part they lost me when they said life is about suffering.

in buddhism, it's not that life is about suffering but that

the pali word dukkha is difficult to translate into english, the word roughly corresponding to a number of terms in English including sorrow, suffering, affliction, pain, anxiety, dissatisfaction, discomfort, anguish, stress, misery, aversion and frustration.

"Birth (http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn12/sn12.002.than.html#birth) is dukkha, aging (http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn12/sn12.002.than.html#aging) is dukkha, death (http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn12/sn12.002.than.html#aging) is dukkha; sorrow, lamentation, pain, grief, & despair are dukkha; association with the unbeloved is dukkha; separation from the loved is dukkha; not getting what is wanted is dukkha. In short, the five clinging-aggregates are dukkha."



The First Noble Truth is the truth of suffering. The Pali word—(the Buddha's language)—is dukkha.

Although dukkha usually is translated as suffering, I often find imperfection to be more applicable. Other working definitions of dukkha are unsatisfactory, insubstantial and impermanence.

The Buddha said there are three kinds of dukkha. The first two are inevitable—the third is optional.

The first is dukkha-dukkha ordinary suffering. These include what the Buddha calls the three great teachers: sickness, old age and death, and the loss of a loved one.

The second is viparinama-dukkha. We all confront impermanence, literally, from moment to moment. One instant, we are happy, having a good time, and the next we are aware that our happinesswill pass. For me, this awareness is often tinged with sadness, and explains why the Buddha says that even happiness is dukkha.

The third is samkhara-dukkha—the suffering of conditioned states. With samkhara-dukkha, we clearly see that the mind has a mind of its own. Corrado Pensa, a beloved teacher warns, \"Be careful when you enter your mind, it may lead you behind enemy lines.\" This is the dukkha that we can do something about. This is the illness that the Buddha is talking about in his medical model.

[Killy]

All I know is that energy cannot be created or destroyed...simply transferred :cool:

so who cares what happens really. The Bible is bullshit, the Koran is a lie...

;)
I wouldn't say I believed in 'reincarnation' though...........

just energy :)
I'm with ya on that.

[Bhairava]

in buddhism, it's not that life is about suffering but that

the pali word dukkha is difficult to translate into english, the word roughly corresponding to a number of terms in English including sorrow, suffering, affliction, pain, anxiety, dissatisfaction, discomfort, anguish, stress, misery, aversion and frustration.

\"Birth (\"http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn12/sn12.002.than.html#birth\") is dukkha, aging (\"http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn12/sn12.002.than.html#aging\") is dukkha, death (\"http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn12/sn12.002.than.html#aging\") is dukkha; sorrow, lamentation, pain, grief, & despair are dukkha; association with the unbeloved is dukkha; separation from the loved is dukkha; not getting what is wanted is dukkha. In short, the five clinging-aggregates are dukkha.\"


ok that sorta makes sense to me. but its still basically saying life is about suffering cause according to what you listed above everything haveing to do with life includes sorrow, suffering, affliction, pain, anxiety, dissatisfaction, discomfort, anguish, stress, misery, aversion and frustration. mayabe im missing the point. but with that being said is there anything in buddhism that says you can lessen or end the suffering? and have a good prosperous life? just curious.

[Killy]

ok that sorta makes sense to me. but its still basically saying life is about suffering cause according to what you listed above everything haveing to do with life includes sorrow, suffering, affliction, pain, anxiety, dissatisfaction, discomfort, anguish, stress, misery, aversion and frustration. mayabe im missing the point. but with that being said is there anything in buddhism that says you can lessen or end the suffering? and have a good prosperous life? just curious.
It is called enlightenment. The end goal of all Buddhists if I'm not mistaken. Life is essentially hell as you are doomed to repeat it in one form or another until you reach enlightenment.

[KC Meat]

...and have a good prosperous life?Eh, that's ambiguous...depends on what one would consider prosperous...

[Walka]

to the great taco stand in the sky

[s0crat0kes]

A theory I came up w/ on my own is that when you die or come close to death your brain releases a bunch of wacked out chemicals and you have a vivid hallucination, which in affect becomes where you go when you die so to speak, at least thats where you believe you went. Perhaps its from a lack of oxygen as the heart stops pumping that causes the hallucination. Anyways since coming up with this belief several years ago, others have told me they believe the same thing.

I have as much evidence to back this as Christians have to backup heaven, so I dunno.

[optimuz-prym]

It's called DMT, and there's proof it's released into your system when you're about to die.

[Bhairava]

It is called enlightenment. The end goal of all Buddhists if I'm not mistaken. Life is essentially hell as you are doomed to repeat it in one form or another until you reach enlightenment.

well that is pretty much what I got out of it. I only asked cause I thought maybe there was something else, like in Hinduism there are ways to resolve your karmas, obtain physical prosperity/enjoyment; like good fortune, great wealth(includeing all forms of wealth not just material), good health, good luck. fullfillment of your desires etc... and still obtain spiritual enlightenment. so you can not only help end or lessen the suffering in your current life with out completely tossing away the physical world. but also pave the way for good future lives with the ultimate goal of samadhi or enlightenment. which is exactly what i was looking for in a spiritual path. to many spiritual paths/religions whatever you want to call it focus on whatever you do in this life determines where you will be after this life. its like its all preperation for the Unkown with sayings like "its ok if your dirt poor and starving in this life, cause if you do good deeds pray and go to church you will go to heaven where Gods House has many mansions" or if you do good deeds in this life you will have a better next life!! but you still have to suffer now! its like who cares what happens to you after you die! its the unknown! for all anyone really knows when you die thats it! nothing. but we hold on to the belief that there is more. Im a person that likes to live in the now. whats happening right now is important not what may be waiting for me in the future. so with that being said in reference to my previous post thats why i chose my current path over say Buddhism or other. cause its like I can sorta have my cake and eat it too and there is nothing wrong with that especially if I share;)

[kaelorama]

to the great taco stand in the sky

Man this isnt State Street

[PapaChops]

Life is pain, suffering sadness and death. That's why it's so beautiful. It's beautiful because despite all of the pain we endure through our lives, we can still find joy and happiness amidst it all. Along the way towards the end you'll meet good people, maybe fall in love and quite possibly start a family.

Where're we going when we die? When I get there I'll let ya know:D

[KC Meat]

Where're we going when we die? When I get there I'll let ya know:DYea, how convenient...the only people who know the answer are dead...assholes...

[Killy]

We should use the dark magic to bring them back then kick their ass.

[Blacksunshine]

I know...it's dumb, so I just have no choice but to sit here on this earth and prophesize for myself. it's enetertaining enough tho

[KC Meat]

We should ask them what happens when you die FIRST...then kick their ass...

[optimuz-prym]

I don't believe in living in the now because the present doesn't exist. As soon as you can say it's the present, it's the past. We're always living in a constant state of barely past. Time only exists to keep everything from happening all at once.

[Punkie]

I don't believe in living in the now because the present doesn't exist. As soon as you can say it's the present, it's the past. We're always living in a constant state of barely past. Time only exists to keep everything from happening all at once.

My brain just exploded all over my computer..... what a mess..... Thanks a lot!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

[Blacksunshine]

and oddly, i thought it made complete sence.


Posts. Pasts.

[Punkie]

and oddly, i thought it made complete sence.


Posts. Pasts.

Exactly my problem. people rarely make sence these here days

[Drew]

ok that sorta makes sense to me. but its still basically saying life is about suffering cause according to what you listed above everything haveing to do with life includes sorrow, suffering, affliction, pain, anxiety, dissatisfaction, discomfort, anguish, stress, misery, aversion and frustration. mayabe im missing the point. but with that being said is there anything in buddhism that says you can lessen or end the suffering? and have a good prosperous life? just curious.

that's what buddhism is about, is ending the suffering.


The Nature of Dukkha (\"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha\"): This is the noble truth of \"dukkha\": Birth is dukkha, aging is dukkha, sickness is dukkha, death is dukkha; union with what is displeasing is dukkha; separation from what is pleasing is dukkha; not to get what one wants is dukkha; to get what one does not want is dukkha; in brief, the five aggregates (\"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skandha\") subject to clinging are dukkha.
The Origin of Dukkha (Samudaya): This is the noble truth of the origin of dukkha: It is this craving (\"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanha\") which leads to renewed existence (\"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebirth_%28Buddhism%29\"), accompanied by delight and lust, seeking delight here and there; that is, craving for sensual pleasures, craving for existence, craving for extermination.
The Cessation of Dukkha (Nirodha): This is the noble truth of the cessation of dukkha: It is the remainderless fading away and cessation of that same craving, the giving up and relinquishing of it, freedom from it, and non-reliance on it.
The Way Leading to the Cessation of Dukkha (Magga): This is the noble truth of the way leading to the cessation of dukkha: It is this Noble Eightfold Path (\"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_Eightfold_Path\"); that is, right view, right intention, right speech, right action, right livelihood, right effort, right mindfulness, right concentration.

[Bubbles]

I choose to not care what happens to me when I die. I only care about how I make myself and others feel... so it's best to have good morals and to be nice. I was raised Mormon until I moved out of my mom's place. I remember stressing out about where I'd end up every day. With my anxiety, this just wasn't good. That's why worrying about it simply isn't worth it to me. I'm fine as long as I feel like I'm a good person.

[s0crat0kes]

It's called DMT, and there's proof it's released into your system when you're about to die.

No shit huh? I'll have to start making more theories with absolutely zero proof if this shit keeps up.

And then I will become President.

[optimuz-prym]

Seriously. It's fool proof.

[Kaos]

yeah, DMT is the " Light at the end of the tunnel " i remember that from an Anatomy and physiology class...

As for what happens to me when im dead, ill be dead, they will put me in a box, or burn me, or just toss me to the crows, in any situation, the end result is the same, ill be dead, and i wont care....

Personally i feel that there is to much thought as to the afterlife, people both blindly end their lives and limit the actions of their life, due to there concerns over the afterlife,

Christians believe there is a hell, and by commiting sin, you go there, some Muslims believe if they kill themselves killing infidels, they get some number of virgins up in the afterlife.

no one has proof of either one being true,

ill continue to do what I feel is right, and to hell with Hell...

[optimuz-prym]

yeah, DMT is the " Light at the end of the tunnel " i remember that from an Anatomy and physiology class...

As for what happens to me when im dead, ill be dead, they will put me in a box, or burn me, or just toss me to the crows, in any situation, the end result is the same, ill be dead, and i wont care....

Personally i feel that there is to much thought as to the afterlife, people both blindly end their lives and limit the actions of their life, due to there concerns over the afterlife,

Christians believe there is a hell, and by commiting sin, you go there, some Muslims believe if they kill themselves killing infidels, they get some number of virgins up in the afterlife.

no one has proof of either one being true,

ill continue to do what I feel is right, and to hell with Hell...

Well-said. In regards to the DMT thing, that would explain why DMT 'trips' when smoked are said to feel like dying or leaving oneself...that would be extremely accurate in association with death. The DMT is released in a last ditch effort to shock your senses back to coherency.

[KC Meat]

...some Muslims believe if they kill themselves killing infidels, they get some number of virgins up in the afterlife.I don't understand their obsession with virgins in the afterlife...virgins = no experience...do they honestly expect good head from a virgin?! They should modify it to a certain number of sex godesses...

[KC Meat]

The DMT is released in a last ditch effort to shock your senses back to coherency....or to make death painless and easy...kinda like "SHIT! We're goin down! We're dying! Release the DMT, make this easy!"

[Kaos]

Ive never understood it either, personally, if im going to have to spend eternity with a bitch, or 40 for that matter.. i want chicks that know something i dont....

40 virgins x Missionary x Eternity = REALLY FUCKING BORING.....

[KC Meat]

I guess with virgins you can train them to EXACTLY what you want...but can you say the dirty things you need/want to in order to train them in heaven?!

[optimuz-prym]

When they're virgins, you can convince them that they're SUPPOSED to swallow. :) I'm totally kidding.

[Kaos]

Regardless of if you can or can not say to them....


Can you imagine spending eternity TRYING to teach them to do it right?

Or could you imagine spending eternity dealing with the giggles some virgins are going to get when she hears where your think your putting it....

Personally the heaven the muslim faith holds so dear, sounds like an absolute living hell to me....

[whathappin]

I dont belive in organized religion. But i do belive in a higher power, I do belive that when i die i will go to another relm. Wheather it be heaven or another stage in eternity.

but eternity is still just a thought concept of a limtless scale of time. As man we have a concept of death, meaning time stops, but does it really.


All I know is that energy cannot be created or destroyed...simply transferred :cool:

so who cares what happens really. The Bible is bullshit, the Koran is a lie...

;)
:)



Its like a black hole, if u lived on the opposite of its polarity, would u be living in a sub-atomic level of life, or just not exsist at all?

[Rebel]

All I know is that energy cannot be created or destroyed...simply transferred :cool:

AGREED





I wouldn't say I believed in 'reincarnation' though...........

just energy :)
But if you said that energyis transferred could it not be transferred into another being, or "soon to be being" making that energy able to be reincarnated?

[optimuz-prym]

:cool:

AGREED




But if you said that energyis transferred could it not be transferred into another being, or "soon to be being" making that energy able to be reincarnated?

I agree with this, although in my opinion, that energy would not quintessentially remain you. It would then become someone or something else's energy.

[T.Beck]

How did I not see this discussion before. Um, I have 2 friends in white shirts and ties that travel around together that we can talk about these things with. WHere am I going? WHy am I here?

I don't like the idea of the Chrsitian Heaven and Hell, like where is the line drawn? this person barely missed the heaven cutoff so now they are in Hell??

This is why The Church of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints explaination, also known as the TRUTH, is much more just and logical. For those that don't know, I will explain brielfy.

WE are children of God, made in his image, we come to earth to recieve a body and learn and grow and work towards becoming perfected like God. Because Adam fell we all are imperfect and sin, thus Jesus Christ came, the son of God, and a God himself, he lived a perfect life and then suffered for all, both for sin and sickness, disease, all afflictions, so that we, through his vicarious suffereing for and behalf of us, may repent and become perfected like our Heavenly Father. He also put in place ordinances with symbolism necessary to enter the kingdom of God. All will be given the opportunity to receive this message, the good news of Christ. Thus, immediately after dying we are in a temporary state, before a final judgement. This temporary state we call "Paradise" which is kinda like heaven, it is where those of have accepted Christ and repented go, and they teach those who have not yet heard the gospel of Christ. Those are can either accept what they are taught or not, just like here on earth. Upon accepting they too are in this state of paradise and teach others. This "Paradise" is basically on earth, just another Realm or demension, where spirit beings live. Ocassionally they manifest themselves to those on earth.

Because of Christs ressurrection, all will be ressurected when Christ returns to the earth, those that had been dwelling in this state of Paradise are resurrected at this time, where they dwell on earth with Christ as King for 1,000 years, this is to give enough time for all to be taught of Christ, there are Billions of people that have lived after all.

After this "millinium" all are resurrected, Satan is able to dwell back on earth for a period to try his last attempt at tempting souls to follow him. Then a final judgement is made.

There are 3 degrees of glory, that of the Sun, the Moon, and the Stars and within each degree there are degrees. The Father the Son and the Holy Ghost Dwell in the Celestial Kingdom, Christ visits the Moon or Terrestial Kingdom, and The Holy Ghost the Stars or the Telestial Kingdom.

The Celestial Kingdom are those that obeyed, accepted Christ Repented, and some, sealed to their Families for all eternity. Some who never were sealed are there as well as angels.

Terrestial are good people, but they didn't live up to all God asked or didn't fully accept Christs doctrine. They are single for eternity and are not with their families but still in a degree of glory better than earth life.

Telestial are made up of sinners, those who were taught and denied, and chose a path of sin. This is very similar to earth life, but still better. The suffering of these people comes in knowing what they could have attained had they made different choices.

Outer Darkness is for those who had a Knowledge of Christ and still denyed, like they had seen and spoke with him, and then followed Satan, there are very very few, and the suffer for eternity.

Thats kind of LDS doctrine in a nutshell, a long nutshell if anyone has made it this far. Anymore questions and refer to:

http://www.mormon.org/mormonorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=3ff8ca451c69f010VgnV CM1000003a94610aRCRD&locale=0

[Blacksunshine]

i actually couldnt read all of that.


so in summary T.Beck

Where do YOU go when YOU die?? I think that is what the question was. And can you summarize in your own words of YOUR thoghts? The two boys in my neighborhood are always trying to do the same thing...so we all have heard it a million times...how to get there, and why. The question is where will YOU go when YOU die? Thanks :)

[Walka]

How did I not see this discussion before. Um, I have 2 friends in white shirts and ties that travel around together that we can talk about these things with. WHere am I going? WHy am I here?

I don't like the idea of the Chrsitian Heaven and Hell, like where is the line drawn? this person barely missed the heaven cutoff so now they are in Hell??

This is why The Church of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints explaination, also known as the TRUTH, is much more just and logical. For those that don't know, I will explain brielfy.

WE are children of God, made in his image, we come to earth to recieve a body and learn and grow and work towards becoming perfected like God. Because Adam fell we all are imperfect and sin, thus Jesus Christ came, the son of God, and a God himself, he lived a perfect life and then suffered for all, both for sin and sickness, disease, all afflictions, so that we, through his vicarious suffereing for and behalf of us, may repent and become perfected like our Heavenly Father. He also put in place ordinances with symbolism necessary to enter the kingdom of God. All will be given the opportunity to receive this message, the good news of Christ. Thus, immediately after dying we are in a temporary state, before a final judgement. This temporary state we call \"Paradise\" which is kinda like heaven, it is where those of have accepted Christ and repented go, and they teach those who have not yet heard the gospel of Christ. Those are can either accept what they are taught or not, just like here on earth. Upon accepting they too are in this state of paradise and teach others. This \"Paradise\" is basically on earth, just another Realm or demension, where spirit beings live. Ocassionally they manifest themselves to those on earth.

Because of Christs ressurrection, all will be ressurected when Christ returns to the earth, those that had been dwelling in this state of Paradise are resurrected at this time, where they dwell on earth with Christ as King for 1,000 years, this is to give enough time for all to be taught of Christ, there are Billions of people that have lived after all.

After this \"millinium\" all are resurrected, Satan is able to dwell back on earth for a period to try his last attempt at tempting souls to follow him. Then a final judgement is made.

There are 3 degrees of glory, that of the Sun, the Moon, and the Stars and within each degree there are degrees. The Father the Son and the Holy Ghost Dwell in the Celestial Kingdom, Christ visits the Moon or Terrestial Kingdom, and The Holy Ghost the Stars or the Telestial Kingdom.

The Celestial Kingdom are those that obeyed, accepted Christ Repented, and some, sealed to their Families for all eternity. Some who never were sealed are there as well as angels.

Terrestial are good people, but they didn't live up to all God asked or didn't fully accept Christs doctrine. They are single for eternity and are not with their families but still in a degree of glory better than earth life.

Telestial are made up of sinners, those who were taught and denied, and chose a path of sin. This is very similar to earth life, but still better. The suffering of these people comes in knowing what they could have attained had they made different choices.

Outer Darkness is for those who had a Knowledge of Christ and still denyed, like they had seen and spoke with him, and then followed Satan, there are very very few, and the suffer for eternity.

Thats kind of LDS doctrine in a nutshell, a long nutshell if anyone has made it this far. Anymore questions and refer to:

http://www.mormon.org/mormonorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=3ff8ca451c69f010VgnV CM1000003a94610aRCRD&locale=0

"Truth"?

bah.

[whathappin]

How did I not see this discussion before. Um, I have 2 friends in white shirts and ties that travel around together that we can talk about these things with. WHere am I going? WHy am I here?

I don't like the idea of the Chrsitian Heaven and Hell, like where is the line drawn? this person barely missed the heaven cutoff so now they are in Hell??


http://www.mormon.org/mormonorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=3ff8ca451c69f010VgnV CM1000003a94610aRCRD&locale=0




Its just a way of manipulation to understand death and what is associated with its concept itself. It is a form of reincarnation, for the the belief that u still have an exsistence with feeling either of torment or non-torment. Thus being hell or heaven.

[Blacksunshine]

wait a minute...Tbeck....did YOU leave that "business card" in my door?

I had a business card lookin thingy that said where are you going why are you here stuff.


I didn't keep it, had a phone number on it tho. Wonder if it was yours :confused:


hmmmm

[Kaos]

T.Beck

I would really like to know where you got the crack your smoking, and how much you pay for it, as it must be absolutely the GREATEST SHIT ON THE PLANET.....

you really want to know the truth, the REAL HONEST TO GOD Truth.......








None of us know, not a single one of us, not even the fucking POPE knows if there is a heaven or a hell, or a god or not, the fact that you are so willing to name the " LDS church " as the " Absolute Truth "

Proves you are nothing more then another head of cattle in the great mormon BUSINESS of selling god, congrats on being a tool....

I really hope your warm and fuzzy feelings you get, by lying to yourself about god and the afterlife, are enough to keep you happy in your life of obvious oblivious ignorance....

Sheep like you are the reason humanity is where its at, Complacent, comfortable, unwilling to rock the boat, cause a scene, or question those who " Claim " to know this or that.

when the grey matter starts forming between your ears, thats a brain, PLEASE, LEARN HOW TO USE IT, And THINK FOR YOURSELF...


You sound just like every other damn little goody goody mormon kid ive ever met... your all the same, cant think for yourself, follow those before you, and you never deviate from the beaten accepted footsteps of those sheep who went before you.

Your parents must be so fucking proud of you....

[T.Beck]

This is funny because you obviously haven't read my past posts. This is what I believe to be true, however I am FAR FAR FAR from the typical mormon sheep you speak of, which I do agree, a lot are.

I am a very logical person that uses Reason to make decisions. Having a hard time finding much reason in most religion, truth is a lifelong process in which I am still engaged in. I have read and studied many religions, and I have searched and studied. I also have read just about every "anti-mormon" thing one can come across. I by all means did not just blindly believe what I was told, I found out for myself, which everyone at some point must do. Relying on other people's faith only lasts so long.

I searched, I studied, and Read, and most importantly, I asked God, and through the power of revelation through the holy spirit, he let me know, just as he promises. For me this afterlife explaination makes the most logical sense as well.

I continually have to go through this process, all my life I seek to gain further knowledge through study and prayer.

Knowing that I have something to look forward to beyond this life, helps coping with the bad things in this life. Its all learning and progression.

[suckafish]

kaos.. brah..

you don't know if there's a heaven or hell either.

so what makes you so sure t.beck is wrong?

y'know a wise man once said, "there's nothing tastier than 2 high school girls diking out in a tub full of chocolate pudding."

[Blacksunshine]

ya know what i always find most ironic about all these religions saying you go here, you go there, you be here, because your that, this is the way it is...


Ultamately in MY belief system...becuase I like my own, it's comforting..is I will see you ALL on the flip side...hows that for a slap in the face?


Im an energy person tho ;)

So whether you are good or bad...I'll see your little cosmos out there in what I would like to think of as Fun land aka as anywhere you would like to be at that moment. But, hey, I figure when I go...and am not comming back...i'd rather go everywhere then just anywhere...so I'll stick with that, and just take what I get. :)


The only problem that I have with political religion...is that it creates judgement. They say dont be judgmental...then tell you what is right and wrong...it makes no fucking sence...it's a wirl wind of failure once all the words are spoken if you dont want to be judgemental, you cant create judgement, it dosn't make sence....yet there they are, all those religions out there...being more fucking judgemental then the last. it's odd.

[T.Beck]

my lil bro was raised mormon is now agnostic. He hated the idea that there is nothing after death though, that was his problem with no belief in God. Then he read this book about how fast technoligy is advancing and its advancing on an exponential curve. There will soon be artificial intelligence, and all disease and whatnot will be curable and or replaceable by robots and how we humans will entirely integrate and become part human part robot basically. And this book was not a fiction novel it was a real scientist stating his theories with reasoned logic behind it. So this satisfied my brothers beliefs because now he thinks he is not ever going to die because all this will happen in his lifetime. Kinda odd but interesting thought huh?

Funny thing about my bro, he is really smart, he is only 18 yrs old and is a Senior Chemical engineering major at BYU, thats what ironic, he goes to BYU, doesn't believe in God and drinks/uses some drugs.

He still hasn't ruled out God entirely and said he is going to do more searching, but right now thats what he thinks, that he wont die because of technologies advancement.

[KC Meat]

robots = evolution of humans...no?

[Drew]

i find more comfort in accepting that there is nothing after death than i ever did in any church.

but i understand why a lot of people are extremely uncomfortable with the idea. if you believe that life has a purpose and that you are playing a part, and that you will continue on in death, then it doesn't matter what you do in life as long as you're good. if you die, and there's an afterlife, kudos, and if there's not, then you won't be aware. so it's a win-win situation.

[KC Meat]

if you die, and there's an afterlife, kudos, and if there's not, then you won't be aware. so it's a win-win situation.Yea, but where's the risk in that? What's life w/o a little risk here and there? ;)

[Blacksunshine]

[quote=T.Beck;32372]my lil bro was raised mormon is now agnostic. He hated the idea that there is nothing after death though, that was his problem with no belief in God. Then he read this book about how fast technoligy is advancing and its advancing on an exponential curve. There will soon be artificial intelligence, and all disease and whatnot will be curable and or replaceable by robots and how we humans will entirely integrate and become part human part robot basically. And this book was not a fiction novel it was a real scientist stating his theories with reasoned logic behind it. So this satisfied my brothers beliefs because now he thinks he is not ever going to die because all this will happen in his lifetime. Kinda odd but interesting thought huh?




I think that ^^ is as odd as this:




WE are children of God, made in his image, we come to earth to recieve a body and learn and grow and work towards becoming perfected like God. Because Adam fell we all are imperfect and sin, thus Jesus Christ came, the son of God, and a God himself, he lived a perfect life and then suffered for all, both for sin and sickness, disease, all afflictions, so that we, through his vicarious suffereing for and behalf of us, may repent and become perfected like our Heavenly Father. He also put in place ordinances with symbolism necessary to enter the kingdom of God. All will be given the opportunity to receive this message, the good news of Christ. Thus, immediately after dying we are in a temporary state, before a final judgement. This temporary state we call "Paradise" which is kinda like heaven, it is where those of have accepted Christ and repented go, and they teach those who have not yet heard the gospel of Christ. Those are can either accept what they are taught or not, just like here on earth. Upon accepting they too are in this state of paradise and teach others. This "Paradise" is basically on earth, just another Realm or demension, where spirit beings live. Ocassionally they manifest themselves to those on earth.

Because of Christs ressurrection, all will be ressurected when Christ returns to the earth, those that had been dwelling in this state of Paradise are resurrected at this time, where they dwell on earth with Christ as King for 1,000 years, this is to give enough time for all to be taught of Christ, there are Billions of people that have lived after all.

After this "millinium" all are resurrected, Satan is able to dwell back on earth for a period to try his last attempt at tempting souls to follow him. Then a final judgement is made.

There are 3 degrees of glory, that of the Sun, the Moon, and the Stars and within each degree there are degrees. The Father the Son and the Holy Ghost Dwell in the Celestial Kingdom, Christ visits the Moon or Terrestial Kingdom, and The Holy Ghost the Stars or the Telestial Kingdom.

The Celestial Kingdom are those that obeyed, accepted Christ Repented, and some, sealed to their Families for all eternity. Some who never were sealed are there as well as angels.

Terrestial are good people, but they didn't live up to all God asked or didn't fully accept Christs doctrine. They are single for eternity and are not with their families but still in a degree of glory better than earth life.

Telestial are made up of sinners, those who were taught and denied, and chose a path of sin. This is very similar to earth life, but still better. The suffering of these people comes in knowing what they could have attained had they made different choices.

Outer Darkness is for those who had a Knowledge of Christ and still denyed, like they had seen and spoke with him, and then followed Satan, there are very very few, and the suffer for eternity.











No, I dont find it weird for a non believer to attend BYU...they should be more open to that...it's unfortunate that he cant be honest while in their halls...i bet anyway...that too is weird.


So, in the end..you really cant call anyones ideas of the afterlife odd.

[T.Beck]

Oh he's honest about it. Thats where I respect my brother more than a lot of jack mormons. He is honest, many go to church on Sunday and pretend to believe but really don't, and they'll give a talk on the word of wisdom the day after they got wasted on Sat. My brother doesn't hide it, he openly admits he doesn't believe in God. You have to get an "ecclesiastical endorsement" to go to BYU, and his Bishop said even though he doesn't believe as long as he is going to church and taking the required religion classes and doing what he needs to do to "gain a testimony" its ok. But ya, he straight up says, "I'm not going on a mission I don't believe in God"

He does have to hide his drinking, its funny, he got in trouble for Weed, and they drug tested him, then his roommates were drug addicts and their whole apartment got in trouble, even though they weren't BYU students, and my brother passed his test he was still in trouble for not telling on them. LAME. So now he is on the final straw, if he does anything he is kicked out, without review, just kicked out cuz he has gotten in trouble so much, and he has to have 2 more drug tests. Still the moron drinks, risking his education, one more year and he's a chemical engineer.

Whats funny is it confuses BYU cuz he has these drug and drinking problems but then gets A's in the hardest classes there are and he is 4 years younger or more than everyone else in the classes.

[Bhairava]

if you die, and there's an afterlife, kudos, and if there's not, then you won't be aware. so it's a win-win situation.

Word!

[Blacksunshine]

Oh he's honest about it. Thats where I respect my brother more than a lot of jack mormons. He is honest, many go to church on Sunday and pretend to believe but really don't, and they'll give a talk on the word of wisdom the day after they got wasted on Sat. My brother doesn't hide it, he openly admits he doesn't believe in God. You have to get an "ecclesiastical endorsement" to go to BYU, and his Bishop said even though he doesn't believe as long as he is going to church and taking the required religion classes and doing what he needs to do to "gain a testimony" its ok. But ya, he straight up says, "I'm not going on a mission I don't believe in God"

He does have to hide his drinking, its funny, he got in trouble for Weed, and they drug tested him, then his roommates were drug addicts and their whole apartment got in trouble, even though they weren't BYU students, and my brother passed his test he was still in trouble for not telling on them. LAME. So now he is on the final straw, if he does anything he is kicked out, without review, just kicked out cuz he has gotten in trouble so much, and he has to have 2 more drug tests. Still the moron drinks, risking his education, one more year and he's a chemical engineer.

Whats funny is it confuses BYU cuz he has these drug and drinking problems but then gets A's in the hardest classes there are and he is 4 years younger or more than everyone else in the classes.


it's perfectly easy to drink and do what ever extra curricular activity you want to do (drugs if that be it)...it's called dedication, commitment, and responsibility. So I dont find that "impressive" but props to him for getting a's in school!! i hope he goes far, I'm sure he will actually...in the real world (at least they are supposed to) you can be what ever religion you want to be and have a job, we hope that REALLY happens all around one day...but that would be called peace...and well thats a whole other thread.

AND I QUOTE: and his Bishop said even though he doesn't believe as long as he is going to church and taking the required religion classes and doing what he needs to do to "gain a testimony" its ok. End quote

That line right there, tells me that he's NOT being honest. That is actually the opposite...but ya know...ya have to do what you have to do I guess. the church of jesus college education is telling him to lie to himself in order to get an education and be in that school...contradiction, but what ever floats your boat. I have a cousin that is going there out of his will becuase his dad donates $$...schools are weird...I'm sure BYU isn't the only one...they are just the only one that will make you lie about your faith in order to go there. Seems odd. But many things do.

I see how you could've mis understood me tho..in that he can be honest with his friends..or you..or what ever...but not in the hallways...he is supposed to be on his way to testimony...you just said so. I dont think that in order to be anything you should have to commit yourself to spreading shit around...so if in LDS you are to go on a mission and sell your religion in order to go to this ever enlightning cellestial kingdom...have fun...I'm sure that your bro will be fine as well.

[T.Beck]

Well, ya he is dishonest with BYU, he is honest with his family though, like my parents know, he is openly agnostic and openly drinks, he doesn't try hiding who he is. It is a delima with my parents because they want him to get an education but they know if they tell BYU what he does he'll be kicked out.

Oh and I know people can use drugs and live perfectly productive lives, its only the small percentage of Addicts that cannot. Where I was saying BYU honor code office is confused is that typically the students they deal with that are using drugs the other signs are lack of interest in school, missing class, falling grades etc. etc.

[ambeestar]

Well, ya he is dishonest with BYU, he is honest with his family though, like my parents know, he is openly agnostic and openly drinks, he doesn't try hiding who he is. It is a delima with my parents because they want him to get an education but they know if they tell BYU what he does he'll be kicked out.

Oh and I know people can use drugs and live perfectly productive lives, its only the small percentage of Addicts that cannot. Where I was saying BYU honor code office is confused is that typically the students they deal with that are using drugs the other signs are lack of interest in school, missing class, falling grades etc. etc.

wow. typically? are you kidding me? typically, i know a lot more people on this board that drink than people who go to BYU. and most of us have respectable jobs, earn a living, and do whatever partying we do on the weekends.
you keep saying that it's confusing BYU that he's drinking so much, but doing his school work. If they're so confused, then they must know, and they're keeping him there on their own free will. So why would your parents hide it? Somehow that's not quite making sense to me.

[ambeestar]

I searched, I studied, and Read, and most importantly, I asked God, and through the power of revelation through the holy spirit, he let me know, just as he promises. For me this afterlife explaination makes the most logical sense as well.



by the way... some people would call this schizophrenia.

[optimuz-prym]

There are a lot of really good points being made here. I had a sneaking suspicion this would turn into a somewhat religious debate, which isn't bad by any means. On a personal note, I think it was unnecessary to give everyone here a lesson on the LDS church. I'm not saying no one here cares, but if people wanted to be preached to, they'd go to church or answer their doors when the suit and ties come knocking. Everyone will believe what they so choose. I'm still looking for a decent answer from a religious person as to how all religions can exist simultaneously knowing full well that they can't all be true. No one has been able to give me a sufficient answer because everyone knows deep down that religion is a mask for fear. Hold on to anything you can to give your life purpose and meaning. I'm not saying that's a bad thing necessarily, but I know how much kids are scrutinized for having imaginary friends, so who's to think you're any more sane for believing in some man in the sky that supposedly talks to you? That's good fucking acid if you ask me. :2cents:

.moses.

[Bhairava]

for those of you that dont believe in a Higher power or Gods or the soul, thats cool to each there own. but just becuase these things may seem like delusions to you. doesnt mean they dont exsist! maybe some people are more open and supseptable(sp) to these things then others or perhaps some of us just close them off in disbelief! and maybe some of us just dont care enough to see past the physical Universe. but how can you explain true out of body experiences or people that can leave the physical body at will? and travel out of body? just curious. I mean just cause you never experienced it for yourself doesnt mean it cant be done! The universe is full of life! why couldnt it be full of Life that we as humans couldnt possibly even begin to fully understand! living inteligent Energy? Spirit beings? Gods? Demons? other worldly beings? I think the universe is full of different dimensions and unlimited possibilities and uncountable forms of life. maybe the soul is as simple as a point of light not like human form like in movies or as described in the bible but a simple concious point of light that goes on and on forever. but anyway just cause you dont believe in anything farther then your own physical body or the physical world for that matter doesnt mean that those that do believe are insane or delusional! maybe they have just taken the time and had the interest enough to search it out! and look past physical exsistence. im not saying this applys to everyone that believes or even every religion! this world is full of sheep! and they believe what they are told to believe. and feel how they are told to feel. and that gives those that have truely experienced a bad name. anyway open mindedness works both ways! <---that was the point of this! lol

[whathappin]

. but how can you explain true out of body experiences or people that can leave the physical body at will? and travel out of body? just curious.



I have had these experiences before first one was when I was huffing gas, and for the transecendentilizm or how ever it is spelled it is all in what u allow ur mind to believe in sorta like remote viewing.

[Bhairava]

I have had these experiences before first one was when I was huffing gas, and for the transecendentilizm or how ever it is spelled it is all in what u allow ur mind to believe in sorta like remote viewing.

Drug induced hallucinations are'nt the same thing.

[ambeestar]

Drug induced hallucinations are'nt the same thing.

in all honesty, you don't know that. for all you know, every 'prophet' who has ever said that they've talked to someone, or had an out of body experience could've been higher than a kite.

[Bhairava]

in all honesty, you don't know that. for all you know, every 'prophet' who has ever said that they've talked to someone, or had an out of body experience could've been higher than a kite.

umm...these things are not limited to "Prophets" as you call them. as for whether they were in altered states or not you'd have to ask them. Normal everyday people who have nothing to gain from this have these experiences as well. some publicize on it and tell everyone, others only tell a few people. and probably some don’t tell anyone. and yes I do know that Drug induced Hallucinations are not the same thing. cause truly in an altered state, how can you truly distinguish a full on hallucination from a real experience, you can't your state of consciousness is altered due to a substance and may in fact be stimulating parts of your brain and nervous system that would produce hallucinations. if these things are experienced sober and unaltered through meditation, or other practices. the experience is more likely to be real. so Drug induced Hallucinations are not the same.

[whathappin]

in all honesty, you don't know that. for all you know, every 'prophet' who has ever said that they've talked to someone, or had an out of body experience could've been higher than a kite.


i would agree with this statement there are many tribes throught the world that still live outside of a modernized civilization, that partake in drugs to cleanse the soul through hallucinations, because of the drug chemical make up inside of its leaves, due to the toxicity of poisinous chemical compounds inside its cellular structures.

[ambeestar]

umm...these things are not limited to "Prophets" as you call them. as for whether they were in altered states or not you'd have to ask them. Normal everyday people who have nothing to gain from this have these experiences as well. some publicize on it and tell everyone, others only tell a few people. and probably some don’t tell anyone. and yes I do know that Drug induced Hallucinations are not the same thing. cause truly in an altered state, how can you truly distinguish a full on hallucination from a real experience, you can't your state of consciousness is altered due to a substance and may in fact be stimulating parts of your brain and nervous system that would produce hallucinations. if these things are experienced sober and unaltered through meditation, or other practices. the experience is more likely to be real. so Drug induced Hallucinations are not the same.

Just because you know that, doesn't mean that someone else knows that as pointed out very well here:


...there are many tribes throught the world that still live outside of a modernized civilization, that partake in drugs to cleanse the soul through hallucinations, because of the drug chemical make up inside of its leaves, due to the toxicity of poisinous chemical compounds inside its cellular structures.

those tribes aren't prophets, they aren't anything special to us... but what they experience is very real and religious to them. they have no idea that they're just tripping on whatever they happened to eat/drink. i understand the point that you're trying to make, but it's not going to fly for the simple reason that almost anything in nature can be turned into a hallucinogen mixed with the right chemicals. Thos chemicals can also come from simple things in nature. So... say you're hungry Joseph Smith in 1823-1827 when he was "visited by the angel Moroni". He's hungry, he comes across some weird berries and some what look like mushrooms. He eats a bunch, he feels sustained, and suprisingly well... almost euphoric. Then, out of nowhere, here comes Moroni telling him he has to go find some gold plates and publish some book...

Now, first of all, because of the amount of food in that area, there would've been no reason for Joseph Smith to leave just yet. Especially because now he's being visited by weird people while there. Those berries/mushrooms sustained him well enough, and like I said.. he felt good. So there he stays, eating mushrooms, freaking out and being visited by some angel. Thus, the mormon religion begins.

I agree that there are people all the time who say that they are visited by someone, they don't have to be prophets in order to have that happen to them. But what happens to them? They get locked up tight. People think they're fucking crazy. Why? Because it has never been scientifically proven that angels or whatever just come out of nowhere preaching some bull shit religion.

And that's the truth.

[whathappin]

^^^^^word to that^^^^^

[suckafish]

Because it has never been scientifically proven that angels or whatever just come out of nowhere preaching some bull shit religion.you don't scientifically prove religion. that's why they call it "faith" duh.

[ambeestar]

you don't scientifically prove religion. that's why they call it "faith" duh.

and that's why i'll stick with the notion that absolutely no one knows 100% what will happen when we die.

we can only bring up theories. i just don't want to be preached to. :)

[Bhairava]

why does everyone in Utah,.... ok almost everyone In Utah use Morminism to bash on Religion and spiritual paths, Mormons Hardly speak for the rest of the worlds Faiths, Spiritual Paths and Religions and they can hardly be quoted for truth! and in my opinion they sure as hell dont speak for any real God. I think its sad that Morminism has effected so many non Mormans in this way and to the point that they have been completley turned off from ever seeking spiritual anything. And spiritual things can actually be proven scientifically maybe not by useing conventional science but Science non the less its called "Occult sciences." and yes it is considered a Science.

[ambeestar]

Mormonism has affected people in Utah because they have forced themselves on every part of this state, in every event they possibly can, with the exception of things like Pride. And sadly... with every mormon friend I've ever hung out with, all their family did was bash on other religions.

[suckafish]

it's called a democracy. yeah, i know. but this is america you know how we do "and if you don't like it get the hell out commie."

[T.Beck]

Mormonism has affected people in Utah because they have forced themselves on every part of this state, in every event they possibly can, with the exception of things like Pride. And sadly... with every mormon friend I've ever hung out with, all their family did was bash on other religions.


Ok so I have gotten a little behind on the discussion and haven't read everything to catch up, but this just pisses me off, it makes me irritated when I hear about fellow mormons bashing on other religions, it is opposite of what we are taught. Don't let your friends families judge the faith as a whole.

To the person that said "we didn't need a less on mormonism" I simply answered the question at hand

[ambeestar]

I'm just going by what I've experienced firsthand, which is how I had answered this thread to begin with. From everything I've seen, organized religion has caused nothing but chaos, or sometimes, wars.

[optimuz-prym]

I'm just going by what I've experienced firsthand, which is how I had answered this thread to begin with. From everything I've seen, organized religion has caused nothing but chaos, or sometimes, wars.

MOST OF THE TIME, it causes war.

[KC Meat]

The cause of every war is the same thing that causes every individual's downfall: ego ...the human ego will be the end of this planet...

[suckafish]

..and crackheads.

[Kaos]

Ego is a much more dangerous thing then Crackheads.

i just want to know this.

before jesus, there was Zeus, before Zeus, there was Ra, the further back in history you go, the more gods existed in the ideals of the human populace.

so did Ra decide that the egyptians didnt build pyramids fast enough in his honor, and abandon them, or did he sell his godhood to Zeus for pennies on the dollar so that zeus could move in the outsourced roman gods and increase productivity in the working masses of people?

and something tells me Zeus, the thunder god would NOT be willing to give up ultimate control of the world, to a weakling dirty footed hippy like Jesus who couldnt even keep himself alive on this plane of existance....


ive been waiting since i first learned about religion, to know how and why, there can be a multitude of religions on earth, with an entire legion of gods and goddesses. all claiming to be the one true religion.

the only real conclusion i can think of, is either god is a schizophrenic, or humanity as a whole is dumber then anyone ever gave them credit for...

considering i can see the rampant stupidity of humanity every waking moment of every day of my life, im pretty sure the latter is the more true ideal.

[Blacksunshine]

Ok so I have gotten a little behind on the discussion and haven't read everything to catch up, but this just pisses me off, it makes me irritated when I hear about fellow mormons bashing on other religions, it is opposite of what we are taught. Don't let your friends families judge the faith as a whole.

To the person that said "we didn't need a less on mormonism" I simply answered the question at hand



I thought this was rather cute.

My grandma (bless her, she died) used to pray for me...She asked if that was okay. is said...what ever makes you feel better grama. I dont understand what praying for someone could ever do for the person you are praying for...but what ever floats boats I guess.


This Has nothing to do with you post, persay, but I didn't want it to be random, and this fit.

[optimuz-prym]

Whether you believe in prayer personally (i don't), it's not so much the praying, but the channeling of subconsciousness thought. There's a site called 10000thoughts.com or something like that where someone will post a problem and everyone that reads it will 'pray' for 5 minutes for that person. Whether you believe in this stuff or not, there is legitimacy to it. Thought can be a very powerful thing, especially when it's directed towards you.